What is this term “Gaslighting”? How it is utilized and ways we can deal with it as a warrior should. Then we respond to a listener who posted back on the article and subject who had a different POV on it.

This week joined by co-host: Aaron “Grizz” Griswold.

A gaslighter is someone who denies responsibility by misappropriating blame or dismissing your points and emotions.

I ran across this great article on Medium about Gaslighting and it made me think about it in a very deep way. How i’ve maybe done it to other people, have had it done to me and what i’ve witnessed first hand others’ going through:

Gaslighters are everywhere. They are in the bedroom and they are in the boardroom. They are our parents, our siblings, and even our closest friends. Refusing to admit who this person is will not change them, it will only lead us further down the rabbit hole of delusion and loss.

Full article here: Gaslighting phrases you aren’t paying attention to

Gaslighting

Transcript:

0:07
Welcome to the warrior mindset podcast. We’re your guide as you make your way through life getting better 1% every day, we believe that life is lived and true victory one through adversity, nothing easy is ever worth it. We believe in the warrior ethos and support those that choose to walk that path.

0:35
You will already get started.

0:37
What?

0:39
Oh, how am I gaslighting? You

0:40
powered up? Saying that I don’t love you because I have to leave at a certain time to pick up my daughter. Gas gas like that’s the definition of gaslighting right there and Okay, guess what we’re talking about today.

0:54
We’re talking about gaslighting.

0:55
Now that I know what it is. I didn’t. I had to ask you when one of our previous podcasts like What is it? What is gas like what you read? Okay, yeah,

1:10
I’m doing two things at once. Because I started before I was actually prepared, but that’s okay.

1:18
It’s on me. Wait, now you’re gonna look at Facebook. Great. Yeah.

1:22
So gas lighting, gas lighting. I think here I’ll read the Google that.

1:28
Okay. Good job.

1:30
It’s a verb to manipulate someone by psychological means into questioning their own sanity.

1:39
Get it?

1:40
Yes. I now understand. I do. I do want to find out the etymology of what actually gaslighting was before it got turned into this term. Oh, that’s Sorry, I should have made you look that up first. So okay. We don’t have young Jamie in the background.

1:58
Yeah.

2:00
Well, typically,

2:03
in this The second thing, gas lighting is a form of manipulation that occurs in abusive relationship is an insidious and sometimes covert type of emotional abuse where the bully or abuser makes the target question their judgment in reality. So ultimately, in a bad, evil, abusive scenario, you would begin to question your sanity. Yes. Right. So like, like one of those Saw movies?

2:31
No, but why are we bringing this back here?

2:33
Why are we bringing so so I asked you, you know, pull gaslighting into warrior mindset. Yeah. And then you’re like, why are we talking about? Well? Yeah, I mean, how can how can we help with that? Well, I

2:48
made a I’m like sitting here. You know, this is the most

2:52
Oh, that’s what you’re doing.

2:54
This is the most awesome episode of worry mindset ever, because it’s just me. Looking through Facebook trying to find the old post was about a month ago.

3:03
How long have you sent me?

3:05
Yeah,

3:06
send your text messages.

3:08
Just.

3:08
You sent it to me. But was it? Okay,

3:11
cool. I’ll do that. Oh, look at that. A Look there. Look at that. How about that? We had,

3:19
you wouldn’t know that we were in technology at all.

3:24
feel like you’re making fun of me. Never.

3:26
I ever do that to you? I don’t think so this gaslighting you might be crazy.

3:31
Now, after I read this article, I was like, is everything everyone does gaslighting me. But why are we I mean, why are we talking about gaslighting on the warrior mindset? And I think Well, first off, I just made a post about it. I found a cool article, and I put it out there and we got I got a lot of feedback on it and actually got some thoughtful feedback from someone and I thought we’d take you know, 30 minutes or so and kind of parse through these things. But first and foremost was, you know how to sort of deal with someone who might be doing these things to you. And you to handle it. Okay. So that I mean to not get stuck, right. I mean, because there’s I don’t think that I think that you can Gaslight someone. I mean, it sounds like a bad term. Right? But I think there’s shades of it. I mean, not everybody who’s you know, maybe doing it not on purpose is like they have nefarious. They want to like psychologically torture you until you kill yourself. I mean, it’s not anybody’s goal. I mean, it’s my goal right now. Yes. This episode, you might want to Yes, I

4:45
was gonna ask you. Okay, so first of all, let’s take out politics. Yeah. Because that’s ghastly. That’s, you know, from the top.

4:55
Yeah, I think I think that’s really where it comes from.

4:57
Right. But well, that’s what’s brought it in vogue now. And then With his made it something that more people are talking about. So but yeah, let’s look, I want to set quick parameters take out politics, because I don’t want to talk about that. And then take out people very close to you that are still part of your everyday life because let’s not talk about those people get in trouble. But yeah, but, you know, can they maybe go backwards? I was gonna ask you have you ever felt in your life? Like, somebody’s like reading this and and maybe not the overt like, you might be crazy, but but reading this do you go back and look at some people in your life and you go damn yeah that you know like yes like they weren’t only they were I mean gaslighting is manipulating. So

6:05
yeah, yeah. And I think it’s that, you know we have this term for it and we have this great article, we have this term for it. I think probably most of the time, if someone’s doing this, they’re not like, here’s my plan to Gaslight, this person. Like they’re just doing it because it’s like, a lot of it is like natural reaction. Sure, you don’t I mean, if you’re, if you’re sort of not emotionally aware of yourself, or others, or you know, you are manipulative, you know, like, I mean, like, a lot of times our kids are, they try to manipulate us and stuff and

6:39
cast lid daily.

6:44
Yeah, it doesn’t mean that our kids are like, nefarious manipulate, well, they aren’t nefarious lighters, their kids, but they’re not evil, right? They’re not doing it like groups or trying to trick you know, Martha into, you know, given the goods up on Superman, you know what I mean? Like, it’s like, they’re just doing it, because it’s, it’s how they get try to get away with stuff. And I think that happens in relationships, too. You know,

7:08
it does. And I sometimes wonder, like, does somebody who? I mean, now I can

7:20
go ahead. Oh, I know. Hey, yeah,

7:21
I was about to say, I don’t want to say the term like 1000 times during this, but yeah, but somebody who I feel like it probably starts with somebody is covering their ass on something. So, so I was also going to ask you have you gaslit? Anybody? And a lot? Sure, exactly. Yeah. Andrew, I think about something that I used to say a lot. Which was, oh, I was just kidding.

7:49
Right?

7:50
I mean, yeah. To me that like that. How about the same as saying, Oh, no, you’re crazy for thinking that I was actually trying? Yeah.

7:59
Right. Think about your own arguments with your wife. Right? Yeah. Well, you’ve been married a long time, like I have. Yeah, I’ve been married 23 years. How long? Have you been married?

8:06
I have been married.

8:09
We’ve been more than 10. Yes, I was more than 20 over 18 1818 years. Congrats. But just think about your own arguments. I mean, as you you know, hopefully, as you get older in your relationship, you tend to be able to get to a point where you can just own your mistakes. You know, you realize that, you know, it’s your wife, she’s gonna see through everything, you know, right, or your significant other, but like, think about your arguments where you’re like, you said something that was maybe hurtful, and then they took it that way. And then you’re like, No, I didn’t mean it. You know, I don’t mean it that way. Right? But you totally fucking did. Right? You know what I mean, right? That’s gaslighting. That’s probably nefarious gaslighting, because you meant to hurt them, and then you were trying to blow it off. So they stopped being mad at you. So you could just well get dinner.

8:58
Please, can we? Um, but but, you know, also, there’s the things that you say in the heat of the moment that you’re like, yeah, I mean, those might be what you’re thinking. And there are definitely things that you’re thinking, but also, like, if you have time to edit it, you would probably not have said that because you know that there’s something bigger that you’re trying to do. You know, like, there’s this whole relationship that you’re trying to continue to have. If you’re not, you know, the one that’s a whole nother story way. Yeah. But, you know, yeah, I think of, you know, childhood and even, I think early into, you know, my relationship with my wife, like, she knows. I don’t say it anymore. You know, I don’t say Oh, it’s just kidding. Because, you know, she’s like, no, you’re not am I?

9:48
Why would you say that? Right? Yeah, it’s like people who say, I don’t care. I don’t really care about that. Right. You know, I mean, come on you. Why are you saying that if you don’t care, it means you care a lot. We tend to have to listen to the opposite right? Read into the opposite of what people say, which is exhausting. But you know, it’s how people are. So the little example from the with the top highlight here, a gas letter is someone who denies responsibility by misappropriating blame or dismissing your points or emotions. So that’s a pretty good one less nefarious riona to the be cool definition definitely sounds evil, but this one is I mean, this was kind of like, there’s different levels of that right?

10:29
Yeah. I mean, well, and I think I told you, I know, I told you and the audience before. Like, I had an ex stepfather that I mean, gaslighter to the extreme liar. I mean, constantly pathological liar. You know, and so you know, and manipulated every single situation, whether he needed to or not. Wow, yeah, so so I’ve got a pretty good art with it. Yeah, I’ve lived with it. So

11:02
how did you feel when we put a name on it like that?

11:05
Um,

11:07
well, I really like you son of a bitch. Or were you like, Oh,

11:12
I think I did see that. Or look at that episode, again, when we’re talking about and I think I said something about I don’t know why I didn’t say I know where you live. And I’m coming. I didn’t say but that’s what Yeah, so I didn’t I’m not kidding. That is what I thought. But, ya know, it’s, it’s something. So I have an archetype to avoid to go, okay. This is a bad human being. Who, again, I think that he started covering his ass first, because of all the lies he was telling, you know, way before I or my mom met him, but then he just kept going. And they know, I mean, allegedly stealing money from a church, you know, things like that. I mean, allegedly, I’ve ever. Um, so it just, I, so I’ve got somebody in mind, but but that’s not even what this this particular article about. This is like the this the subtlety of gaslighting. And, you know, I don’t like what Eb Johnson says, with gas lighters everywhere. Because and I think that that’s something that the person that that sent you the comments

12:32
that we’ll get to him.

12:34
Yeah, but but I think that that right, there is kind of like, it’s a little bit hyperbole. But, but it’s also the truth at the same time. And so, you know, because everybody has done it one way or another, right. And this usually, I still think it’s, you know, you started as covering your ass, but then there are people that continue, like, they find that it worked.

13:01
Yeah, and those are the people that continue to do it. And so you kind of you kind of have the, but again, they’re not like, this is my gaslighting tactics. That’s just how they get out of shit. Right? Exactly. It’s just what works. So it’s their habit. And that’s, that becomes how they are with people. Exactly.

13:19
Exactly.

13:19
We’re the one labeling them. Sure. Would you think in a lot of ways, that’s what happens with the term, you know, the term sounds really bad,

13:25
right? You know, so

13:26
it sounds mean, you know, you wouldn’t call your, you know, four year old kid who’s trying to convince you of something. He’s not evil.

13:33
No, no, but we still do the same stuff. But remember, you were never the bad guy in your own movie.

13:39
Never are so so you don’t know.

13:42
I mean, maybe, you know, maybe, you know, maybe you really know that. Well, I think that’s it. You’re a manipulative person. Right. gaslighter or not?

13:52
I think that’s it. I think that’s that’s the scale, right? It’s the it’s the you’re doing it? You don’t know. Then you do know? Yeah, you’re trying to put pressure on someone to manipulate them. Exactly. Because you’re fucking sick or whatever. Whatever you’re trying to get. Exactly. Yeah, you know, um, so so let’s go through some of these and we’ll get to, to wills, wills post. Okay, so, one example I don’t see what I’ve done wrong.

14:16
Okay, and these are the gaslighting phrases. You aren’t paying attention to this. So again, it’s it’s more subtle, then. Then, you know, oh, you’re crazy for thinking that way.

14:28
Yeah, like, I don’t see what I’ve done wrong. like playing dumb. Right? Yeah. I’m sorry. I didn’t know.

14:34
Yeah. Like,

14:36
I think about like, relationship with my wife where she’s upset about something and I’m just like, be okay. I know. I know.

14:44
I know. You’re not okay.

14:45
Like No, but I know what’s going on. You know, but I’m like, I don’t want to say it right. Cuz then we’re gonna fight and I’m just hoping that you are trying to determine what level of anger you’re at so that I know whether we need to get into it or not.

15:04
And whether we’re going to dinner at 730 or not yesterday. Yeah.

15:07
I mean, I think that’s it. Like, I don’t understand what I did wrong. Please explain it to me. Yeah. And then you’re sort of seeming like you’re open minded, but you already know. And you’re just playing out the game. Yeah, that’s definitely mean. That’s subtle. Because you’re playing, you know, you’re trying to get away with it, even though both sides, you know.

15:31
But I mean, do you want to introduce Will’s question to this?

15:34
Are you ready? Let’s let’s go through them. Okay. Let’s go through them. And then we’ll come back to him. Alright, stop taking thing couldn’t get them quickly. Yeah. Stop taking things personally. Yeah. You taking this too, personally? Yeah, yeah, you’re or you’re just sensitive, right? Yeah,

15:53
exactly. Yeah. Me, maybe I am. But.

16:00
So it’s, it’s more about, not what I did. But it’s about you being overly sensitive to people doing things that I did. Right. Right. You should be less sensitive about it. So it’s about you being just not a right,

16:13
exactly.

16:16
That’s okay. Right. Or, maybe I’m against

16:21
you the only person that thinks this way. Yeah, that

16:24
that right. There is a little more overt and subtle

16:26
that when someone starts to get out of there. Yeah. Because like, like it says here, they’re they’re isolating you, or making you feel alone. Yeah. Which begins to make you question. Or makes you think that you’re different than everyone. Right? Right. Or, or so everybody? I mean, this is what married couples do. You know, everybody does this, you know? So you’re different. Like, the fact that you don’t, or you want to do that, or you don’t want to do that this is not normal. Let me So what? You know what I mean? That’s what I would say like, Well, okay, I don’t like it. I yeah. So deal with that dude, still get so you’re I’m doing something you don’t like, but you got to deal with it. Because you’re the only one in the world that doesn’t like it.

17:15
Right.

17:17
Wait, Wes? You only said it to me. But yes, yeah, yeah. No, the isolation, the item, the making somebody thinks that they are alone in what they believe is is just or unjust. Yeah. Yeah. You know, or fair or unfair? Is? Yes, let’s say, right. I think we’re starting to get into.

17:41
Yeah, it’s a scale. Yeah. Let’s just start over. Start over from square one. That Yeah, I agree with this doesn’t work, right. You can’t just start over, like you have an argument you kind of need to, you need to deal with it. Right? You need to you need to come to terms with what you’re doing wrong. Or, I mean, if it’s just we just have to agree to disagree or whatever, wherever the stalemate is, where you just have to, you have to deal with it. This is just like, this is not dealing with it. And it’s also you’re sort of trying to absolve yourself from dealing with it.

18:18
Yeah. You know, I also, I

18:20
mean, I did something wrong. I don’t want to apologize. I don’t want to put you in a position where you have to Yeah, like accept my apology. So let’s just start over. Okay, Tinder didn’t have I have

18:30
a cool this. No, this is one that that I have questions with when we get to what Wilson?

18:38
Cool. I won’t tolerate lies he brings us up to but

18:48
that’s a weird one. I want maybe just because I haven’t heard it before. In my own life. So so basically the manipulator, I think, I think you’re, you’re lying. I mean it. Yes. The You’re crazy.

19:05
Yes. I’ve seen that in relationships with other people, where one person is like, this other person just does this shit all the time. And it’s not good in it’s ruining this and whatever. And then it’s brought up to the other person. And they’re just like, oh, they’re lying. They tell lies. Oh, I think I think the title, I won’t tell her a lot. I mean, I get it, I get what they’re going for. But that’s what I get. Right. When you confront them about anything that disagrees with a personal narrative. They will claim it’s a lie.

19:39
Yeah. Right.

19:40
I mean, we’ve, we’ve all kind of done that. One side of that where, you know, something will happen. And then you start getting in your own head. And you start creating this narrative of like, why they’re treating me this way. Right. You know what I mean?

19:53
Right? It’s sometimes you’re right.

19:55
Most of the time you’re not right. But let’s say you are right, you confront them about it, and then you’re like, You’re crazy. Or when I said or they lied, you know, or whatever it is. It’s just like, well, I don’t put up with that. Even though they’re still doing the same thing. And you’re just like, Whoa, so you start to think like, well, who’s, I’m the one that’s messed up, because clearly everybody else is like, saying that the shit doesn’t happen, right? You don’t I mean, that’s my take on it. I’ve seen that in practice, okay. with other people in their relationships. It is pretty is pretty ugly. Yeah. In my opinion.

20:35
Yeah.

20:36
So it’s a whole nother thing when when not, I think like in your example, like, it’s one thing if you’re saying it to the person, like I won’t tolerate lies. You’re saying

20:45
to other people, you’re

20:46
saying that other people? You’re like that, you know, yeah, this is a fairy zone. That is that is gone.

20:53
That’s extremely, extremely manipulative. Yeah. To use outside forces to try to control someone. Yeah. In my opinion. All right. It’s all in the past. Suddenly insidious.

21:09
Yeah, like, Why are you bringing that up again? Why are you worrying? Because just because I cheated on you four times. That was in the past? Yeah,

21:19
I was a different person. We’ve

21:20
gotten through that, right. Well, I have.

21:24
Oh, yeah. Well, I have it motherfucker. Guess what? We didn’t deal with us. Right. But yeah. I don’t know about that one.

21:36
It’s, I mean, it’s definitely trying to sweep stuff under the rug. Right. It’s definitely gaslighting in the sense of not, it’s not respecting your issues,

21:48
right, that you might have with me and just not taking responsibility.

21:51
Or not wanting to Yeah,

21:52
right. Right. or, or, or not, or not seeing how something that you’ve done in the past still affects things that happen currently, it might happen in the future. You know, like,

22:04
you see that you’re talking about taking politics out of it. So I’m not going to talk about a particular political thing. But you see it a lot in famous people and politicians when they apologize. They’re not saying the good apologies, or you know, the real ones, but they’re not saying I’m sorry for my actions. I understand my actions. Were not right. It’ll never happen again. And I’ll accept the consequences. That’s what you want to hear. But what they say is, I’m sorry, you had a problem with what I did. Exactly.

22:33
I’m sorry. So took it that way.

22:35
I apologize for that. Yeah. Which means I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing. Because I see

22:42
no problem. What I’m sorry that you don’t like it. Yeah. What the hell’s that? Right. I think that’s kind of maybe in line here a little bit with like, Hey, man, yeah. I can’t change it. So what the fuck are we doing?

22:57
I almost feel like those apologies, the public ones and like on Twitter and on TV and things like that. When when somebody says that, you know, I’m sorry that you took it that way. That that is about as real as you can be. Because that that is somebody who’s, I think that they’re actually at that point, owning it. They’re like, I’m sorry, you took it that way. Yeah. I’m gonna be an asshole for the rest of my life.

23:22
Yep. Deal with it. Deal With what?

23:25
I’m gonna make another apology five years from now for the exact same thing. Yeah. And guess what? We love people that apologize. And we love second and third and fourth chances. So

23:35
yeah, that’s the thing. Like a Shawn Ryan Nielson. Sean

23:39
Ryan,

23:40
does a great little podcast if you’re into, like navy seals and cool shit like that. Well, yeah, he’s a good dude. He’s got a good show. But he does these little like 15 minute, little segments on how to not be a douche. Basically. Yeah. And he’s got one on, like, how to apologize. And he’s just like, it’s like, his simple. You already know what you did. Apologize and mean it. Right. He’s like, you know how you apologize? You say? I’m sorry for what I did. It will never happen again. Right? And then you make damn sure it never happens again. That’s how you apologize and get over something. Yeah, I’m like, it’s so simple. Yeah. You know, it’s like Jocko when he says, like, Well, how do I know how to be a good good man? He’s like, you know, you know, and know what to do. Yeah. It’s so simple. You know, it’s the things we do when no one’s looking. Right. That’s what’s important, right. Alright, so more most so now that we’ve identified all this stuff. And there are definitely you know, worse. Worse cases of gaslighting and I mean, this is I think this is like, you know, subtle stuff in relationships you’ll level to encounter in your life whatever. So how to protect yourself to how do you deal with it, which is the whole point of why I liked the article in the first place, which is not Like, there’s no way I’m being gaslighted. It’s like, Okay, well now do something about it. So do the other side of it, which is the whole worrying mindset part, which is, how do I stop this shit? Yeah. So, you know, this, they’re some of the recommendations here is one of them is rely on your self esteem. Right? I think I think that’s a good one.

25:24
Because

25:27
I think someone who’s who’s doing that, so what he’s taking, they’re taking advantage of your insecurities, right? they’ve identified what your insecurities are in their, their, their way weaponizing them. Right? I think that’s right. So you’ve got to work on that. Right? Right. So in one way, it’s like, you know, the article saying rely on your self esteem, it’s like, well, maybe you don’t have self esteem. And that’s, that’s why you’re being slighted. Right. But I think the, the moral of the story here is that you need to work on your self esteem. And I think that goes beyond the scope of this article. And it’s the whole reason why I created where mindset in the first place, which is, like, we need to be constantly working on ourselves, we have to make time to understand ourselves emotionally, spiritually, you know, physically, that might sound weird, though, to put it in, but like, you need to know what you’re made of, you need to know what you believe you need to know how far you’re going to go with something, you just need to know those things. Yeah.

26:28
And wound kind of going back through those, like, sometimes your self esteem doesn’t come

26:36
from

26:39
doesn’t start with emotional, it can actually I, you can gain self esteem through physical like, accomplishing things. And yet, when we come to another, you know, talk about embracing the suck, you know, that, that I was thinking about, like, it’s, if you can overcome something physically, whether that’s a 45 minute workout, or a 48 hour, you know, about to come out wrong 48 hour trial and tribulation. Physical means you just

27:15
did what, I’ll tell you later. But

27:20
if, or if it’s something, you know, that, like a firefight, you know, or or Street Fighter, you know, whatever it is, if you can make it through through hardship, or through hardship physically.

27:33
Well, the only way to make it through hardship physically is to have a strong mind.

27:37
Yeah, but sometimes, sometimes you make it through physically, and that gives you the self esteem to push further next time. And then so raise the bar up, do it again. Because you know, doing day two or something like the, you know, I will jump out of an airplane once, but then I’m going to have to jump out the second time. Like, oh, I’ve done it before. Yeah, I’ve done it before. Yep, there’s a self esteem thing, but it’s because it’s usually harder to do the second time. Oh, is it? Oh, cuz you I mean that you’re like, Okay, you know, like, maybe,

28:13
I don’t know, they were jumped out of an airplane. Oh, well, no plan to you shit. Nope.

28:17
Okay. Well, the first time for me was great. The second time, little crappy. Third time, I was like, Oh, am I doing this again? You know? You know, 1920, you’re back. Jesus don’t want to do it very much. But, but no, like, the second time of doing something or or, you know, it always kind of sucks. And you have to have the self esteem, you have to have the mental fortitude in order to, to do it again. But sometimes just doing it, that’s the whole like, yeah, set the bar low. It’s extremely freeing. Yeah, do it. And then that helps build self esteem. So I ask you this,

28:56
how many times in your life have you had someone in in your life in a while, like, they’re not a huge part of it, but they’re a part of it, say like, you know, 25% of your life, whatever, which maybe that’s huge. I don’t know, a friend, a good friend, close friend, whatever. And you’re sort of like, you always feel kind of crappy, about the way they make you feel or whatever it is to be around them or whatever, but you’re always around them. And then whatever happens, you know, around them anymore. And you start to see, or to feel, or to listen to other stories from other people that you’ve previously ignored. Yeah. That guy was a son of a bitch. Like, how many times that happened? Yeah. I think it’s partly one, it’s that one. You’ve got them out of your life, but it’s also, you know, you’re maybe it’s self esteem, like your, your energy levels higher, you’re just more aware of the bullshit and then you’re like, why did I put up with all that? Yeah, you know,

29:52
I see. Well, you know,

29:54
I was saying everyone that’s addicted, I was aghast, like,

29:57
but I see it every once in a while too and like some of the Facebook groups determine for, like, the exercise programs I do. And, you know, I have joined my wife and I have joined them to, you know, just it’s a little community, but every once a while there would be like a story in there, like, you know, the mean, you know, I lost 250 pounds, right is one thing, but, you know, like I,

30:24
I,

30:27
you know, my husband left me with two kids and, and, you know, no money in boba, and, you know, doing this workout program consistently, whether I wanted to or not brought me to a point to where my self esteem started to rise. And so I kept doing it more, and maybe you get a little bit, you know, like, not psychotic about a bit, but you get a little bit like, it’s what drives you, so that it keeps driving you. And it’s a little cyclical there. But that, you know, and then like, a year later, you see them and they’re like, you know, I’ve got a great relationship with somebody else who’s not been appealed of, and doesn’t cheat on me, right, you know, my kids are thriving, you know, have money again, and I fucking look awesome. You know, like, all those things. Like, sometimes I feel like that physical thing, if you just keep doing it will help your self esteem. And so then then you can rely on your self esteem when you have, you know, and you know, what to recognize when somebody is acting like that again, in your life that you let back in? Yeah. And so yes, yeah, that, you know, that 25% of the time or whatever it is, like, yes, you find that feel lighter. You’re like, Oh, yeah, yeah, but you also, I mean, like, like, any type of good conditioning, like, your physical conditioning, your body knows what to do. Now, from mental conditioning is right, your your brain is rain. That’s bullshit. Yeah, yeah. You’re like, I

32:10
ain’t dealing with it. Right.

32:11
Now. Sometimes people can take it to extreme and like, Well, you know, everyone’s like, yeah,

32:15
that’s a different problem. Right?

32:16
But but I think it’s you. But yes, you should rely on your self esteem when it comes to people like this, because that is exactly what they prey upon. It is for nefarious reasons. Yeah. So but you know, a way to get that self esteem if you don’t have it, maybe is a physical thing, maybe that you just keep doing. And you show yourself that you can do one thing, right? Yep. Because it builds on the manipulator, like gaslighter will not only tear you down on one thing, they will tear you down on everything else. That’s right. Well, that’s their goal. Exactly. Well, there’s some for some fucking reason What is wrong with you?

32:54
Number two, here, I think two or three go together, but make a record of issues. Yeah. Right. So I’ve actually told several people to do this. In their relationships, where they were. It’s been a business mostly like their like, you think about, I mean, the flip the script here a little bit. Like if you’re, if you’re in a business, and you have an employee that kind of keeps fucking up. Yeah.

33:23
Oh, you have to knock you’re not in a giant

33:24
way. Like, you know, if an employee comes in and steals a bunch of crap that’s peeling each one of those, but if they keep kind of farting around and messing stuff up, you get to keep a record of that stuff. Well, it works in relationships, too. If you feel like you’re being mentally screwed with Yeah, ie got eg gaslighting or whatever. But like, you can, you can intercept like, according to the article, you don’t have to, like, lead to be a giant spreadsheet with like calendars of shit, you just take notes. He said, Well, he did this, and I felt weird. He needed this info. And then you could see patterns. It’s like anything here. I know, you got to track these things. I mean, we tell people to write down what they’re eating, you know, track your workouts. Same thing. Yeah. But it leads to the second part, which is stand up, but don’t argue. And the article is kind of telling you how to stand up to someone like that. Because in my own experience, and in my experience, seeing people deal with some of this. The act of standing up someone who’s gaslighting you usually creates more problems. Yeah, because they get more angry. And I’ve seen them throw fits. Yeah, you know, and then like, really have an argument that you don’t want that? No, but a good way to do it is just document that stuff. And then be like, Look, bro, this is what you’ve been doing. Explain to me why it’s so right. It’s fat, man, put it on them. And then they have to like either keep lying or deal with it. And then you know, yeah. I think the other side is like, you’re only going to be able to truly deal with someone who’s doing this to you. If you’re willing to walk away.

34:54
Yeah. Yeah. And that’s hard.

34:56
I mean, that’s the hardest thing, but I think that’s the way to get If you care about that person who might be doing that to you, you have to, you know, document this shit put in front of them and then be willing to let it go. By let it go. I mean, leave. Yeah, you know, I’m

35:15
in

35:16
because you have to stay ultimatum, right? It’s like a contract, why do you have a contract if you’re never gonna enforce it? Right, right. That’s why we have contracts, you know, if, if we have a contract, but I’m never gonna enforce it, why are we even signing the contract? It’s just dumb. Right?

35:30
No, and, you know, it’s not always relation. I mean, you know, in, in, you know, in our relationships with our spouses, you know, there’s a relationship that you built over 20 something years. But there’s also, you know, for both you and I, there are kids involved. Oh, yeah. And their emotions, and, you know, there’s other human beings that have to deal with that. There’s money and property involved. You know, then there’s, like, other relationships that are outside of the nucleolar unit, that are involved, too, and probably much more things. So. So yes, you have to be willing to walk away and then I was thinking of business too, you know? Yeah. walked away from Yep, you know, a lot of money. It sucks stolen from me. And and yeah, it sucks. It sucks, but at some point,

36:28
can’t carry it with you forever. Yeah, he just can’t, you can’t,

36:32
you won’t ever grow, you won’t ever proceed into the future. Right? And, you know, to at least one of those people, I’ve gone back and said, I forgive you. Yeah, whether they cared that I’ve, you know, this isn’t about whether or not it’s about that I’m forgiving, you know, I can move on.

36:49
And let’s The best thing you can do. Exactly. Because it’s like, I’m gonna talk to you again. Right? Be like,

36:54
exactly, but you can also I mean, but also this is like, when you stand up, yes, you have to be willing to walk away. And that is hard. For many reasons. It is, but but yes, not arguing. It’s the same thing of, you know, I told you about, you know, giving negative feedback to somebody, they’re going to be defensive. Yep. Hey, by the way, you might be a gas lighter, they’re gonna be defensive. And then if you are counter defensive with them, if you start to argue, you know, once you stand up, yeah, you know, you’re arguing about something different at that point, you’re not actually arguing about the issues. And, and, and so bringing facts into it is extremely important. Yeah, and it’s hard. Yes, we have

37:38
to record them in the first place. Right? Um, you don’t want to be going through from memory?

37:43
No, because, you know, human memory that Yeah, you lie to yourself as to what actually happened. Yep. Even if you’re being desolate, your your human memory is not it’s not

37:53
perfect. You know,

37:55
it brings up what it was really

37:56
based on emotion to know you’re gonna recall your emotional state, not the actual facts. Exactly. Um, you know, that kind of go along here, but, um, in martial arts in, you know, the warrior class, Samurai warrior class, Bushido. Whichever level, there’s a there’s a, there’s a saying, or whatever that’s Do not fear death. Right, which I think is it’s cool. But like, when we put it in that connotation of like, Samurai who were like, they committed seppuku and cut each other’s heads off shit. It sounds like really cool, whatever. But I don’t think they necessarily specifically meant actual death. I think Yeah, like feudal Japan, right. Probably lopping off heads, I get it. But, you know, then there was a time where they weren’t at war. And the samurai became a little more, you know, psychological, they became a little more they wrote poems and things like that. So this is where we actually get this stuff written out. Do not fear death. I think it also is a way to walk the path to be willing to walk away from something. Yeah, like, always engineer. This is an extreme side of it. But engineer, your relationships engineer, your businesses, engineer, your possessions, whatever, so that you can walk away from it and not be heartbroken. Yeah, you don’t I mean, and that does get really sticky when you talk about your wife and kids, because you don’t want to walk away from your wife and kids. I get it. Hopefully, you’ve made very good cognitive, emotional, spiritual decisions on why you got into that relationship in the first place. And you’re down that path together. Yeah, that’s a different subject. But I think the basis of not fearing death, always being able to walk away from something like the death of a relationship. It’s okay. You know what I mean?

39:47
Have your emotional go bag,

39:49
pretty much and you know, and I tried it. Again, I’m not perfect at this, but I try to do this. I’d really try hard to let everyone know how I feel about them. Yeah. In our friendships, I tried to state it, I try to say it. I think nowadays we were kind of scared to have this conversation, you escaped, you’re kind of scared to look at your friend and say, Man, you’re my good friend, you know, I got you. I love you. You know, we don’t want to say those things anymore. Yeah. But I think it’s important. And then if you don’t feel that level with someone, the hell you hanging out with them for, like, you’re just wasting your time, you only have so much time to spend with people, when we’re getting somewhere else. But you get where I’m going with this, I think you can apply that same thinking to whatever level you want to just

Transcribed by https://otter.ai


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